Australia's second ever Holden revealed

[Aussie Bob]

Australia's second ever Holden revealed

http://media.theage.com.au/news/nationa ... om=newsbox


Discovery of missing link in Holden history: a special FX masterpiece

http://www.theage.com.au/victoria/disco ... 1ey2x.html

[FBeing]

Very interesting Steve
I think it's been 'revealed' here before...
http://www.fbekholden.com/forum/viewtop ... 15&t=10040

[Mick]

that's what people do the more they put there version of what something is out there it then spreads (and with the internet like wildfire ) and all of a sudden myth becomes reallity

and wouldn't you know it something in association with "that car" click on the link and my computer shuts it down says there's a virus

[Cal]

1.2 million bucks?

You would want to make sure the car is the actual N0.2 before lobbing over that sort of coin. You'd want some sort of verification from Holden, not just heresay

So is this the same car and guy that was posting here a while back?

[Aussie Bob]

Spot the differences .......



General Motors USA no 1 Prototype Tag





The age article USA no-2 Tag




General Motors Holden australian FX Tag

[wot179]

I know this guy comes across a bit arrogant,but Im prepared to give him the benefit of the doubt.

He certainly sounds like he has all the info.

I can see the difference in the tags,but I dont personally believe it has much bearing on reality,as nobody could really say if the tags on number 1 are authentic either.

Just that they were known of and rediscovered first.

Lots of water under the bridge with the possibility of all manner of "personalised" authenicity measures that could have been perpetrated on either of these cars either by workers at GMH or previous owners,for all manner of innocent or mischievous reasons.

Im not wishing to cast doubt on either car,Im very far from an expert,and Ive never seen either car,but thats my take on it.

However,if I was parting with over a million bucks for it,I would want to see the paperwork.

[Cal]

So is it the same guy that posted here a while ago, or not??

Even if it is No.2, I personally think anyone that would even think of paying that much money for it has rocks in their head.

[Aussie Bob]

Hi Pete, yes it is the same guy ....

W-179. I think what is interesting, is that the top of the tag where it should say "General Motors Corporation" is conveniently blanked out .....?

It appears to be an Australian Tag in many ways .... if you have a close look. Not a US tag like the No-1 .... BTW..... which has a MILE of provenience.

Steve

[wot179]

I agree with you 100% on the tag.

It has also be affixed with steel pop rivets by the look of it.

What I am saying is that there are many reasons this could have occurred,plenty of them legit,lost in the sands of time,or privvy only to the current owner.

If the car has all the handmade panels as claimed,I see not much reason to doubt the cars authenticity,especially if he genuinely has all the supporting documentation.

Are there other examples with handmade panels about the place?

I would love to see his pile of ducumentation and spares,but only because I am a sticky beak and love the mystery surrounding a lot of the special old girls.

I would love to see everything you have on your prototype as well,and to hear the entire story of its discovery,as I am sure you have kept a bit close to your chest.

Theres nothing wrong or sinister about that;niether car is mine and its not my business.

As I say,I will give him the benefit of the doubt unless he is proven unequivically to have made up the whole story.

[Stygian]

As soon as I saw it I thought that tag has definitely been tampered with. So that raises legitimate doubts about authenticity. If it has hand-made panels and he has the paperwork, why forge an ID plate? Doesn't make sense. If it wasn't with the car, why not just say that and use the panels and paperwork as evidence, unless that too is questionable.
If anyone advances a particular statement as true, such as "I own the 2nd prototype 48/215", then the onus is on them to provide proof of the truth of their claim. It is not up to others to prove them wrong.

[Mick]

really the No1 tag looks shonkier than the No2 tag based on the fact the No1 tag is NOT fitted to a car and is all shinney, the 3rd tag shown i'm guessing is only as an egzample but the rivets definately look wrong and the FX looks to be engraved on
don't take this the wrong way steve but haveing seen the tag on yor "special" EK the "special" looks like it could have been put on by anybody, it's nothing like any printing/stamping i've seen on any tags (this is only used as an egzample as there isn't alot of oddball cars to compare tags with ) i've also seen a tag on a commodore with VD as the model prefix which was never produced, IT was a very convincing tag as the lettering/stamping was identical and no signs of removal of other letters or that the tag had been off the car, i've also seen blank tags for sale on ebay got all the GMH etc but none of the details filled in

i'm with wot on this too don't care if he has it or doesn't have it, it won't affect my life, only thing i found a little dodgey was that he didn't know what his old man had as far as cars go also i'de never be paying that sort of money for an early holden no matter what it was, if i had the money there's much better things to spend it on

[Cal]

Same thing Mick said..................this guy seems to know his Holdens, but didn't realise his old man owned the No.2 FX.

I wouldn't put too much emphasis on the compliance plate. It would be very easy to check if it has been forged.

If other things like the hand made panels and stuff check out, it could be the real thing.

[Aussie Bob]

really the No1 tag looks shonkier than the No2 tag based on the fact the No1 tag is NOT fitted to a car and is all shinney, the 3rd tag shown i'm guessing is only as an egzample but the rivets definately look wrong and the FX looks to be engraved on
don't take this the wrong way steve but haveing seen the tag on yor "special" EK the "special" looks like it could have been put on by anybody, it's nothing like any printing/stamping i've seen on any tags (this is only used as an egzample as there isn't alot of oddball cars to compare tags with ) i've also seen a tag on a commodore with VD as the model prefix which was never produced, IT was a very convincing tag as the lettering/stamping was identical and no signs of removal of other letters or that the tag had been off the car, i've also seen blank tags for sale on ebay got all the GMH etc but none of the details filled in

i'm with wot on this too don't care if he has it or doesn't have it, it won't affect my life, only thing i found a little dodgey was that he didn't know what his old man had as far as cars go also i'de never be paying that sort of money for an early holden no matter what it was, if i had the money there's much better things to spend it on

Hi Mick, that's right, the third tag is to show that the Prototype 2 tag is an Australian Tag and not a US tag. The FX was scratched on and the rivets are wrong. There is NO question on the authenticity of the No-1 prototype, with the cars provenance being traceable all the way back to the US.

I am sure it could have been anyone who stamped the SPECIAL on the tag on the Prem proto, but they would have been standing in the Holden Factory when they did


Steve

[Aussie Bob]

Same thing Mick said..................this guy seems to know his Holdens, but didn't realise his old man owned the No.2 FX.

I wouldn't put too much emphasis on the compliance plate. It would be very easy to check if it has been forged.

If other things like the hand made panels and stuff check out, it could be the real thing.

Cal, if one that is educated in the first Holdens can't get past the ID tag, what's the point of further investigation?

Steve

[Cal]

That's my point, there may be a valid reason why it has an Australian tag as opposed to a US one. Or maybe not.


Like Andrew said though, with cars like this one the onus is on the owner to prove it's authenticity.