Making me dizzy - red versus grey distributors

[Harv]

For the Norman project, I 'm looking to add a little more bzzt! to the ignition system on the grey. I want something (relatively) period correct, so late model high-energy ignitions are out. I'm equally not too fussed about points - not driven towards swapping out the dizzy guts for Petronix for example.

I've been tooling around with the idea of running a twin-point dizzy, coupled to a high-winding coil (yeah, I know, one more set of points to bugger up... I can live with that). A couple of twin-points have gone on eBay of late, but for way more cash than I'm comfortable with (dizzy alone went for more than a grand last night ). This is getting up into the same price range as maggies.... I'd end up with a billion dollar grey at that rate.

An interesting alternative is to buy a brand spanking new twin point dizzy. Mallory make them for Holden 6's (http://mallory-ignition.com/dist-holden-6cyl-dp.html), though I suspect they are for red motors (Mallory couldn't tell me... just Holden 6). Note the one shown in the link above has no vac advance... they do offer a vac advance model. They are not cheap, but for 1/2 the price of an eBay historic twin-point I get a brand spanking new dizzy. The other thing that appeals is that Mallory make a kit for these dizzies with multiple advance spring pairs. This will make regraphing a lot easier... the Norman is going to need about 25-30degrees of total advance, all in at 2500 with the vac in addition to that (plumbed downstream of the blower to give zero vac advance under boost).

I'm guessing that the old twin-points on eBay were not made specifically for greys, and have been modified from Chev L6 versions. I'm wondering if I can take a new Mallory twin point and modify it to bolt onto the grey. I'm guessing the oil pump drive gear will need to be swapped over, and the Mallory shaft modified (ground down) to suit an oil pump drive tang at the bottom. What I'm not sure of is whether a typical red motor dizzy has enough meat in the shaft to allow this. The grey motor dizzy is a stubby little bugger, and I'm hoping the red is longer. I know the advance curves are different in the red, but not too worried - it needs to be regraphed anyway. Any other differences in the red motor dizzies that might stop them being modified for grey? Are the later blue dizzies any different (body/shaft wise)... just in case the Mallory is for a blue?

If anyone has a manky old red motor dizzy that they no longer want, I'd appreciate it for some measuring.

Cheers,
Harv

[MeFB]

Hi Harv,

Can only answer one of those...blue dizzy fits a red motor no problem. Converted my red to a blue electronic dizzy and it dropped straight in.

Can't say I've heard of a red/blue dizzy being put into a grey. I'm sure it can be done, but could be a fair bit of work!!

[MeFB]

Dug this up for you Harv.

http://fefcholden.org.au/forum/index.php?action=search2

Bottom end of a grey dizzy grafted onto a Scorcher. Not quite what you're after as the Scorcher is electronic, but much the same in principle.

Looks like Performance Ignition Services still exist.

Could be worth a phone call?

[Harv]

Thanks Al.... time for some more research for me.

Had it confirmed today that the Mallory dizzies are to suit red (good news).

Cheers,
Harv.

[Brian Westlake]

Is the dizzy clamping system on a grey different to red motor? From memory I think it is.
Tony.

[Harv]

Is the dizzy clamping system on a grey different to red motor?

Slightly different, but similar in concept. Both have a bolt through the engine block, though the clamps are slightly different. Should be able to butcher one to work.

I really need to lay my hands on a grungy red dizzy, then strip a red and grey side by side to measure and head-scratch a bit.

Cheers,
Harv

[choppedfan]

Interested in your comment about not using the Pertronix conversion, I've changed mine over and "touch wood" haven't had any issues at all. I did a fair bit of research and all the reports from others running them in their greys were all good, I will say though before I did the conversion that when I travelled out of town I used to carry a spare set of points and condensor.

But now since I have the Pertronix which has never let me down (boy I'm really tempting fate now ) I carry a spare points dissy that I reconditioned as a backup, what is it about the Pertronix that puts you off mate?

Mick

[Harv]

G'day Mick,

From what I've read, the Pertronix units are pretty damn good. They sound a bit fiddly to install, but once in they seem to be pretty reliable. The only reason I don't want to use them on the Normans is that I'm aiming for (relatively) period gear where I can.

I've now got a standard red dizzy, standard grey dizzy, Mallory red twin point and Scorcher red twin point sitting on the bench. Once I get some time, I'll have a bit of a play and see what can be cobbled together. Running short on time at the minute though - pulled apart the wagon ready for paint and panel, and got stuck into the Norman casings.

Cheers,
Harv

[vmx-mxr]

Hey Harv

I have a red Mallory you are free to check out. You can also compare it to the grey Mallory I also have.

Compared to the Bosch the Mallory twin point for the grey (Part #434A) is massive,and quite a complex looking thing that would be right at home in an aircraft !

Cheers

Dave Mac

[Harv]

Cool - thanks Dave. It will take me a while, but I'll give you a yell once I'm up to that bit.

The only grey Mallory twin I have seen so far is a YC476HP that was on eBay a while back. Some hunting around suggests this is the generic Chev inline 6 dizzy, which someone has modified to suit a grey.


Looks like the oil pump drive tang was ground in, removing the case hardening... some wear evident.

Mallory still makes the red motor dual point, both with vac advance and without.

Cheers,
Harv

[vmx-mxr]

That dissy looks very similar to the one I have except it is taller and the body spigot detail etc is exactly the same as a stock Bosch but sets the height for the dissy body higher. The body is almost identical to the one pictured and has mechanical advance.
Cheers
Dave Mac