fbekholden.com

FB MAD wrote:Where did you get your venturi restrictors from Thommo??

All I can find out is that one of the Holley carb models has a venturi that nearly fits the grey carby but can't find out which one??.

They are a Holley part from Redline / Hardiman
part# 14-35 venturi sleeves

The sleeves will need filing down like you would a set of piston rings
to get them to close up a little more. Mine are glued in position with arildite.

EKjimmy wrote:Thommo- what does raising the oil pressure do? is this in a red motor? just curious
Jimmy

Raising the oil pressure simply ensures there is a good film of oil around the rotating parts.
When a engine is hopped up, there are higher internal pressures on the mechanical components,
Higher compression pushes down harder on the crank during the firing cycle of each cylinder,
so increased oil pressure ensures the oil is not squeezed out under the increased load.

This is on my grey engine, but it applies to all hotties.

When you hop up a engine, there is two things you want to do
1; Make it go better
2: Make it survive at its new performance level

Cheers
Jeff

ah i see, just thought it might have done something else too.
cheers, jimmy

All good Andrew

No hi-jacking mate - this thread is getting a good lot of input from some people who obviously have had some experience. You can't beat that so keep the ideas coming, I sure others are interested too.

Just as a matter of idle curiousity - how much will it cost for the completed crossflow head and cover - it's OK I'll sit down, lol!

Dave Mac

vmx-mxr wrote:All good Andrew

No hi-jacking mate - this thread is getting a good lot of input from some people who obviously have had some experience. You can't beat that so keep the ideas coming, I sure others are interested too.

Just as a matter of idle curiousity - how much will it cost for the completed crossflow head and cover - it's OK I'll sit down, lol!

Dave Mac

Completed crossflow head ?? .................See your bank manager first, then sit down and down a bottle of bourbon or something, it'll make the shock a bit less painfull when you hit the floor.

Yeah FB - I know LOL!

Sure it will cost as much as one or Jackos lovely originals' but curious just the same - there is Lotto you know

Dave Mac

Hey Dave Mac,

I agree, the posts on this thread have been very helpful; and the collegial attitudes expressed by those experienced in hotting up a grey make it even better. Maybe an edited version of this thread or a thread based on this one can become a sticky about hotting up a grey motor?

Sorry to disappoint you, but I do not possess a Repco crossflow head What I do have in my possession is what I believe to be a prototype Repco Highpower manifold for the standard grey motor cylinder head, complete with downdraught Weber carb. I put a post on this forum hoping that someone would know something about it.

Those who have crossflow heads are asking $10,000 for them. However, unless you are a collector, they are not that good a buy. The waterjackets are not of consistent thickness and there is not much meat around the intake and exhaust valves. Consequently, cracking has been a problem.

A Queenslander by the name of Rod Scheffler is casting new reproduction crossflow heads that do not suffer from the above problems. I phoned him last month and he said he aims to have "eveything-you-need" kits ready for sale by then end of this year (i.e. head, rocker cover, sideplate, pushrods, nuts, etc). I asked prices but he was very reluctant to state any. I kept pushing him and he said just for the bare head he will be asking around $5,500.

High price, but I guess he has to recoup the loss incurred by cutting up his own original Repco head to make the moulds and dies for the repo ones , not to mention his other outlays. He may also not want to run down the value of the original heads by selling the repo ones at a reasonably affordable price.

If you are interested, you can ring Rod on 0427 231119. Or if you are still shocked by the price, ask FBMAD to hand you that bottle of bourbon...

Cheers, Andrew

P.S. Thanks to Jeff for revealing what venturi sleeves to use with triple Strommies.

I'm sure they're probably worth the money in terms of what they cost to manufacture and all that, but are you really getting $5500 worth of performance gain with one of these things?

Cal wrote:I'm sure they're probably worth the money in terms of what they cost to manufacture and all that, but are you really getting $5500 worth of performance gain with one of these things?

if yor shelling out for a cross flow head it can't be about performance it's about period correct or just koolness NO OFFENCE THOMMO JUST AN EGZAMPLE but to build something like thommo's engine would not be cheap, for less than the price of the carby setup on thommo's car you could put a 138 red or 149 red in and it would prolly make the same HP may a bit more, then if you want to take the step further and go the crossflow well then yor talking a V6 or V8 conversion and some change and the crossflowed gray wouldn't even see which way the V6/V8 car went
read an article somewhere maybe on here about touring car type racers back in the day big name guys were building engines that were on the limit and making around 100HP you can get that from a stock 149 red

this IS NOT haveing a shot a gray motors just pointing out what are you looking for power + cost or period correct

Hi Cal,

Personally, I think he is asking way too much for a bare head (no machining, no valves, guides, etc). In my opinion, the only people who would be willing to part this much money would be the vintage speedway crowd, who really have no other choice should their original head crack (which apparently they do). Makes me wonder how much he will ask for the complete, bolt on kit

But if someone with the resources wanted to do it (certainly not me, unless I wanted to recklessly spend my house deposit money), then why not? Properly set up and with either a Vauxhall steel crank (the speedway guys use these) or a billet machined one, it would certainly beat the pants off a red motor powered car. Seeing the looks on the faces of the red motor aficionados would be well worth it Moreover, a Repco grey motor FB/EK will fetch far more at sale time than a red motor powered car ever will...

I mean, given the 30 odd grand it takes to build a 350 sbc FB/EK, does someone really get 30 odd grand worth of performance? A slightly worked used XR6 Turbo for the same price would show a clean pair of heels to such a car around the track.

And given the tens of thousands that some are willing to pay for stock factory original cars, a similar question could be asked. Did someone really get 30 grand worth of "originality"? You only have to change one thing on a car and factory originality is gone forever.

As Obi Wan said to Luke Skywalker, the truth depends upon your point of view...

Thanks Ratbox and Edna. I suppose it is more than just about outright performance gains.

I'm just looking at it from a tightarse's perspective. For a little more than what a bare head wil cost, you can have a SBC crate motor with double the BHP that you could ever dream of getting out of a Grey.


Though I suppose with one of these heads you'd be the Victor Bray of the Grey engine fraternity

No offence taken at all Rat.

You and I built/build cars for totally different reasons.

You know you are going to get bored with your cars very quickly,
you know its going to get sold soon after, and you do it on a tight budget.
you come up with great results, have some fun with them, and you know
it will sell for a profit.
Fun/power/speed Per Dollar.

I was only going to do one car, the way I wanted it, to keep.
I started collecting parts with my idea in mind, when all this nostalgia stuff started to take off.
Trouble was, we Aussies seemed to be doing Americian nostalgia (back then)
I wanted to do something local.
Thats how my choices were made.
I knew it wasn't going to be fast compered to other cars, that wasn't the intention.

If someone is going to build a mild/hot grey from an engine that needs a full recon,
It shouldn't cost too much more really.

Stock bottom end - same cost as reco
a cam will need regrinding - just grind to different specs, shouldn't be any dearer
Flywheel will need machining - just take off a little more
Twin carb manifold & two shitty carbs - $100 to $300 depending on your luck.
Reco two carbs - $250
Extractors - $175ish E-bay

This would make a nice little mild motor that looks good & sounds good
with zero rego hassles

Yes you can pick up a red cheaply, but
You'll need
Disc front end
Diff change for compatable brakes
Possable gearbox and tailshaft change (optional)
Floor mods
Engineers report (cost +hassle)
Etc

So a mild or hot grey doesn't throw up the total cost of modifing your early.

Food for thought

Cheers
Jeff

that's why my egzample was a 138 or 149 red none of the stuff from disc brakes down needed including the disc brake front and was a little unfair as i was talking about a good running second hand red motor compared to a built grey

selling them's not behind my red motor preferance, my constant highway use is i did the hotty grey in the chop top fresh 60 thou bottom end 35/75 cam i think it may have been a yella terra head based on the fact it was painted yellow but it definately was modified twin carbs extractors 4 speed looked kool but on the highway it just wasn't a red motor

hope the engine that i'm putting in the FB/EK goes ok $50 138 red

My impression was red motors = brake upgrade in the other states.
I stand corrected.

Thommo wrote:My impression was red motors = brake upgrade in the other states.
I stand corrected.

in NSW only if you go over 15% bigger you need the upgrades engineers report, same thing it's a silly rule but i like it the 15% is based on CI not HP
by the books 138 gray about 60 factory HP 149 red about 100 factory HP close enough to double

Edna Blueflash wrote:Hey Dave Mac,

I kept pushing him and he said just for the bare head he will be asking around $5,500.

Plus intake and exhaust manifolds and right angled distributer seriuosly looks like 8-10k
would you get value for money grunt wise NO cool yes BUT its still not an original I would pay 500 -600 for jack meyers headers but I would not pay what they are asking for the Aussie Speed ones Dont get me wrong I think it is great that there are companies making this gear and there is a lot of cost involved and they need to make a proffit but they are not the genuine item

But if they remade a Dunstan

Ratbox bag the grey all you want at least you have owned and driven oneand reds are better bang for buck but will never look as good its people that say they are crap yet havent even driven/ridden in an FB that shit me (You know who you are)


on a side note Thommo how do you find the lightened flywheel in the hills does it lose power ?